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Four Years Later It's Easy To See That The Paul Johnson Coaching Hire Was One Of The Best In The Country

After the 2007 season, Chan Gailey was fired from Georgia Tech. There was much discussion - and journalistic flaming - about how a football coach who never had a losing season was fired from the Institute. We all knew it had to be done because we were tired of the mediocrity of seven wins. 

Four years later we can look back and see the shrewdness in Dan Radakovich's hiring process. DRad hit a home run with the Paul Johnson hire and made arguably the best hire in the country. In 2004, Dave Braine said we couldn't consistently get to 9 and 10 win seasons and that attitude should not be allowed in an athletic department. I don't think DRad has let that mentality remain either.

Since 2008, there have been 49 different coaching hires around big time college football. Of those hires there has been only 1 national championship (Auburn/ Cam Newton) and 5 conference championships turned out by four different coaches. Paul Johnson is one of the four. The Georgia Tech Yellow Jackets have won 33 games over four years and are on the brink of reaching the 9-win mark in three of those years. Success and progress are strong factors that are solidifying themselves with the Yellow Jacket football program. 

Coachinghires_medium

Do you remember who we all interviewed or who was a fan favorite in 2008? Let's catch up with them.

Star-divide

Charlie Strong

Then: Defensive coordinator under Urban Meyer. Bird created a facebook group for Strong's hiring

Now: Louisville head coach in his first season sitting at 7-65 with a bid to the Orange Bowl a strong possibility even after losing to teams such as Florida International and the Marshall Thundering Herd

Chris Hatcher

Then: A hugely successful Division II coach who had gone 7-4 at Georgia Southern with his "Hatch Attack" offense.

Now: Fired at Southern after going 6-5 in 2008 and 5-6 in 2009. Now coaches at Murray State where the Racers are sitting at 7-4 in the Ohio Valley Conference. 

Joker Phillips

Then: Kentucky Wildcats offensive coordinator to then-head coach Rich Brooks

Now: Hand-picked successor to Rich Brooks. Just completed his second season where he went 5-7 (6-7 in 2010). Kentucky did end a 26-year losing streak to the Tennessee Volunteers to close the season on a high note. 

Will Muschamp

Then: Defensive coordinator at Auburn University. Known of his hugely awesome BMFY phrase. Had some emotional baggage with Tech fans because he went to uga. Eventually made his way to Texas to be the defensive coordinator under Mack Brown

Now: Just took over the reins at Florida and needs to clean up Urban Meyer's mess and lay a new foundation. Total work in progress.

Randy Edsall

Then: A former Georgia Tech assistant coach who took UCONN and made something of it. DRad didn't want to settle nor does he. An Edsall hire would have been settling for the same result with a different face.

Now: As of this entry, he remains the head coach at Maryland. But College Park is in absolute disarray so who knows. The Terrapins had a horrible year, going 2-10 in Edsall's inaugural season.

Jon Tenuta

Then: Former defensive coordinator to Chan Gailey. Many wanted him to have his chance at leading a football team. 

Now: Has moved from Notre Dame to NC State where he is the linebackers coach. I don't think he has interviewed for a head coaching position since he left Georgia Tech.

The Paul Johnson hire was, and still is, a good one. The Chan Gailey equilibrium was consistently seven games and Paul Johnson has taken us to 8+ wins a season on average. So Tech fans, while there are still plenty of areas for improvement, take a step back, and look at the progress along the way.

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My second allegiance (past GT) is with Louisville

Dad was born and raised there. There are a lot of people behind Charlie Strong. He took them from 3 wins and little hope for things getting better under Steve Kragthorpe and took them to a bowl game win in his first season. He’s a good defensive mind and does a lot of recruiting out of the state of Florida, which is very rich with talent. When Randy Shannon was fired from Miami last year, half of their recruits de-committed, and a lot of them committed to Louisville shortly thereafter. This season hasn’t been incredibly impressive, but at the end of the day they’re in position to possibly win the Big East, and they beat West Virginia in Morgantown, something they haven’t done in a long, long time.

I think considering Muschamp’s tenure this year relative to what was there when he came in, it’s fair to say that Charlie Strong is the only coach to really have success in his program from the above list.

The Church of Paul Johnson - There's not much to it outside of whooping ass and giving haters the finger. To HELL With georgie!

by LilBroey700 on Nov 29, 2011 9:35 AM EST up reply actions  

whoah! look who just showed up

i thought you died

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

Twitter, twitter, twitter

by Winfield Featherston on Nov 30, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions  

Haha, thanks for the concern

It’s been a busy month to say the least. December doesn’t look much better.

by acedarney on Nov 30, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions  

As someone who was completely skeptical of the hire...

and after witnessing firsthand the attrociousness of the 2008 Spring game…CPJ has completely sold me. His offense gives us a chance to win pretty much every Saturday. It’s effective with even marginal athletes, and explosive with better playmakers. That fits GT so well from an academic standpoint. That being said, there are some improvements (the IE in me is coming out) that I think he needs to make…

1) Full time special teams coach. I know he goes back with Mike Sewak a long time, but having 2 OL coaches seems strange to me. Time and again this year we were outplayed on special teams, often at critical points in the game. We lack explosiveness in the return game, and consistency in the kicking/coverage game.

2) I like Andy McCollum as a coach, but it seems our recruiting focus has shifted away from Georgia…and towards wherever areas Andy McCollum and Al Groh recruited prior to coming to Tech (North Carolina, DC area). I think we’ve lost so many local recruits because our local network pales in comparison to other SEC/ACC schools. If Francis Kallon was a sophomore, we wouldn’t have a chance to get him by the time he was a senior. So I think we need better performance out of our recruiting office.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 8:58 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

This.

There is tons of local talent to be had, so I really do hope recruiting the state of GA is a priority…but it seems to me like they put an emphasis on this, especially with running backs.

I think getting away from a pro-style offense where we are trying to outrecruit every other big state school around us was a good move….running a pro-style O netted us 7 wins every year and now we’re doing more. Others hate us (especially the obsessed UGA fans) because…well, haters gonna hate.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Florida may have more talent than any other state except Texas

and it doesn’t appear any of the schools down there are making much use it.

This isn’t a response to anything, I just couldn’t resist talking some smack about the poor coaching going on to the south of us.

by Atlanta's original team on Nov 29, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

I am hoping

we take advantage of some of the disarray within the state of FL. UM will not see the postseason for probably at least 2-4 years depending on how bad they get slammed by the ncaa. FSU is picking back up…but there are only so many scholarship players you can take. USF…is USF. And then there’s FL. Charlie Weiss should act like the anti-recruitor as long as he’s there and they continue to go 6-6.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I've never understood CPJ's inability to bring good instate recruits in

Now, disclaimer, I’m a UGA grad (har-har), but unlike what many of you think, I root for Tech 11 games out of 12 a year. I want Tech to be successful, win ACC titles, and play in BCS bowls. I was thrilled with the Paul Johnson hire, although I was obviously (and correctly!) worried about his chances of beating UGA more often.

The one area I think he’s missing in his coaching resume is the ability to be a top flight recruiter. He seems to have this sense that “I did it at Georgia Southern & Navy without 4/5 star players, I can do it here”. And so far, he’s been right. You guys are consistently a threat to other teams due to offensive ingenuity alone. However, that next step needs better talent. Your O-line doesn’t know how to pass block, and it gets your QB killed when you’re in a late game passing situation. You could fix that with a) better offensive line coaching and b) better, bigger recruits. I realize that the option requires faster O-linemen over just beef, but you can get both! The NFL isn’t looking for giant led-footed guys, they want big, fast players. Tech’s got a lot to offer and should be able to get some of them.

Similarly, your defensive recruiting leaves a lot to be desired. You’ve got the occasional high-profile player, but in reality, you can’t just play defense with one guy, no matter his skill (to illustrate, remember how good Calvin Johnson was? There wasn’t enough talent around him). Groh was a great defensive coach/recruiter while at Virginia, and I can only imagine he’ll get that way again soon, but there is plenty of instate talent you guys could be getting, instead of letting it go to Alabama/Auburn/Florida/Florida State/Clemson/South Carolina.

Anyways, here’s hoping for another great game next year!

DawgSports/Falcaholic/Talkin' Chop

by blackertai on Nov 29, 2011 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

One of the biggest misconceptions...

a lot of recruits (as well as the general football public) have is that playing Defense at GT doesn’t prepare you for the next level because you are practicing against a one-dimensional offense all the time.

It’s very rare that at any school, with any kind of offense, 1st team O is scrimmaging against 1st team D on a regular basis. Players get hurt that way. So for that to have become the conventional wisdom is nonsense.

You’re right, there’s no reason for is not to recruit studs on defense…especially with CAG coaching the 3-4 and the recent litany of GT defenders in the NFL.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 3:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

It's true that the scout team will run the offense of the team you're playing the coming week...

… but the scout team doesn’t grow on trees. Those guys either (1) came to play offense at Tech, meaning they want (and are built) to play in the option scheme or (2) just took the best offer they could get to play somewhere, meaning that they’re likely not good enough to simulate strong offenses. Plus the coaches that are preparing the scout team either (1) are paid offensive coaches, meaning they specialize in the option or (2) are unpaid graduate assistants, meaning they are as high quality as the paid coaches.

So, while it may be true that the scout team does not run the triple option at practice, it is safe to conclude that the scout team has neither coaches nor players who run other offenses at a high level.

by first and thom on Nov 29, 2011 5:40 PM EST up reply actions  

As I've told several other UGA know-it-alls

there are quite a few coaching jobs open this week, maybe you should apply.

If you’re going to come over from the UGA blog, at least don’t be so negative all the time :D

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 8:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't mean to be so negative

but it’s like I told someone else, it’s real easy to say all you need to do is recruit some 4/5 * , real athletic players on offense / defense. No kidding…we should just go down to the gettin place and get us some.

Unfortunately there are things that work against us, and not other programs / big state schools. The curriculum is the biggest challenge working against us — and I know people from the Univ of GA like to say we use that as an excuse, but it’s not an excuse if it’s true. I’ve seen it argued many times, but if you look at a lot of the larger state schools in the SE, I’m going to say that GT & GA are two of the best public schools in the entire southeast, and have slightly more challenging requirements for graduation.

We could run a pro-style offense, but we’ve already tried that. The result? Consistent 7-5 seasons from the man in charge. I like our chances better with an option based offense. Now, if we ever regress to the point we’re having consistent mediocre seasons, then it’s time to look at making a change, but I will continue to make donations to the Tech Fund and buy season tickets.

Hell, I don’t care if we kick the ball on every down, as long as we get W’s.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 8:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Giving the devil his due...

UGA is probably the third or fourth best school in the SEC (behind Vandy and maybe Florida and/or Auburn, and now TAMU), after which things drop off quickly. UGA’s recruiting secret is the diversity of their curriculum, not the quality or lack thereof overall (although some majors are certainly easier than others).

To relate it to the ACC, UGA would probably fall behind all the privates (except maybe Miami), Tech, UNC, and UVA and ahead of FSU, Clemson, VPI (slightly), NCSU (ditto), and maybe Maryland.

by jabbajacket on Nov 29, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I gave the bulldawgs their due.

I think they are a good school, and the diversity, or rather lack thereof is exactly what goes against us when going head to head for recruits (in quite a few instances).

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 11:21 PM EST up reply actions  

So which one is it?

Is it the quality of the players on Defense…or the quality of the backup Offensive scout team? How do players recruited to play a Pro style offense give a good look for their Defense when they play a Spread Option team?

That being said, you can’t reproduce the same quality…especially in the trenches.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 8:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I wonder

if that’s why there is a heavy emphasis on recruiting just “ATH” — like having a good practice squad in the NFL? If you have really athletic, talented kids on your practice squad, that could only help you prepare that much more for game day.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 8:44 PM EST up reply actions  

With due respect to Jawjah superfan...

Having Vad Lee run your scout team is a pretty great look for the Tajh Boyd/Logan Thomas types in terms of containing the dual threat. As for trying to mimick what Aaron Murray can do…I doubt any team can recreate that.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 9:04 PM EST up reply actions  

I can get on board with that.

I can also agree with superfan in that Matt Ryans & Tim Tebows don’t grow on trees every day…so you do the best you can with what you got.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 9:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Yeah, Murray was a beast.

…just like Matty Ice. I remember when he kicked our ass in, what, ‘07? But BC’s ginormous “more biscuits maw” OL gave him all day to let a play develop and probably was able to file his taxes while waiting, too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IcJYDqFSWw

by jabbajacket on Nov 29, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions  

The last time Groh came to tech as head coach (2008?)

UVA beat us because their massive o-line gave their mediocre QB 5 minutes to throw the ball. I swear every single one was 6’5" or taller. Whether it’s flag football or NCAA, if you have that much time you will pick apart a D.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions  

It's a problem for any team.

It’s hard to simulate offenses that a team does not run. But the point we were discussing was less about weekly game preparation and more about whether “playing Defense at GT doesn’t prepare you for the next level because you are practicing against a one-dimensional offense all the time.” Over his tenure at Tech, I think a Tech defender will see less offensive variety because Tech generally recruits players and coaches to run and execute the option. The scout team will run pro-style or spread option or west coast, depending on the opponent, but it will always do so with players recruited to play option ball and coaches focusing on option ball. That degree of specialization trickles down into the scout team.

by first and thom on Nov 30, 2011 10:04 AM EST up reply actions  

My argument is simply this...

Quality trumps scheme…every time. It didn’t bother Derrick Morgan or Morgan Burnett to become high draft picks (and NFL starters) even though they faced inferior and specialized scout teamers for their last 2 years at Tech. They produced on the field against all offenses because of their natural ability…not the strength of the scout team.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions  

I think that's right, but you're changing your argument.

Above, you were saying that somebody’s wrong to suggest that Tech’s defense practices against the triple option. I disagreed, pointing out that the scout team will necessarily have many of the same attributes as the first-team O. Now, it seems like you’re saying that it doesn’t matter if Tech’s defense practices against a narrower scheme because player quality trumps scheme.

The truly elite defeners like the two you list are going to excel regardless of scheme. However, I bet that the schemes against which you practice have some effect (whether positive or negative or mixed) on guys who aren’t high draft picks but who could play on Sundays.

by first and thom on Nov 30, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

It certainly affects younger teams...

to not get the best looks against a superior offense. The TD pass to Conley was a good example of a young CB (Sweeting) not reacting to a ball fake and route adjustment.

All I’m saying is practice scheme shouldn’t be a reason for a 4-star DT, or whatever, to wait 2-3 years to get playing time when he could get it damn near immediately at Tech and have the same post-collegiate chance for success in the NFL if that’s their goal.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 12:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

The NFL loves them some 3-4 defensive players

From The Rumble Seat -Drinkin' whiskey clear since 2008.

"You could spend the next fifteen seconds of your life watching a man and a tiger scream together, or you could be an idiot."
Fact.

by Jesse28 on Nov 30, 2011 12:42 PM EST up reply actions  

That makes sense.

Al Groh certainly has a well-won reputation for creating NFL-caliber defenders out of less-than-stellar recruiting classes at UVA.

by first and thom on Nov 30, 2011 2:23 PM EST up reply actions  

first and thom

So your post about the scout team basically said or implied that (1) players recruited for option football are inferior to players players recrutied for other schemes, (2) GT is a school of last resort for players who can’t get offers elsewhere because they are not any good, (3) the knowledge of the coaching staff is limited to option football, and (4) the coaching staff, which has coaches with decades of experience, is no better than a graduate assistant with only a few years of experience.

If all that is true, then I think GT football has bigger problems than the quality of the scout team.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 30, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions  

I think a typo of mine has caused some confusion.

The point we were discussing is whether, as TBuzz put it, “playing Defense at GT doesn’t prepare you for the next level because you are practicing against a one-dimensional offense all the time.” He argued that the D didn’t just play against the offense, which is certainly correct. However, I pointed out that the scout team necessarily shares attributes with the first team offense, so someone looking at a GT defender could conclude that he sees less offensive variety than a defender at another school.

I’ll respond to your numbered points: (1) No. Players recruited to play option ball are different. Smaller, quicker OL, no TE( especially a hybrid TE that is emerging as a pass-catching threat in many offenses), and WRs with a heavy emphasis on blocking. The players are (generally) speciallized, not inferior. (2) No. Every team has walk-ons that are perpetual scout teamers with no hope of seeing the field and no offers to play elsewhere. These players are not as good as the scholarship players at the same school. I was not trying to compare them to players at other schools. (3) No. The offensive coaching staff is specialized in option football. Their study and emphasis is on using the specialized players to maximize results out of the system Tech plays. The same is true for every team: other teams’ coaches may be familiar with the option, but that doesn’t mean that their scout teams will be as well-coached at option ball as Tech’s. (4) Dang. Typo. The GA’s are NOT as high quality as the paid coaches.

Does that clear it up?

by first and thom on Nov 30, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions  

It does

A few comments for consideration. A lot of college teams run spread offenses, which is an offense that is not seen in NFL (though I think that is starting to change). Isn’t it fair to say that the defenders who play on these spread offense teams also seeing somewhat ‘one-dimensional’ offenses in practice since the players are recruited for a spread, not, say, an I-formation or pro-set?

Before the last NFL draft I read some articles that wondered about how well Cam Newton would do in the NFL because the perception was that being in the spread at Auburn, he didn’t have to make the type or quantity of reads required of an NFL QB.

There are teams whose offense goes pass, pass, pass, and pass some more. Running to them is like passing for GT. Aren’t the defenders on these teams also seeing a bit of a ‘one-dimensional’ offenses in practice since the players are recruited for a passing offense? I think the NFL tends to be more balanced in the run-pass ratio.

I guess what I’m trying to point out is that I see your point about the scout team sharing attribute of the offense and therefore the defense may less variety from the scout team. However, it seems like that would be true for any team that deviates too far from the offenses that are played in the NFL.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 30, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

Good post

And you said a mouthful. I went off on another topic about the restrictions of Tech’s curriculum and I’m not going to reiterate it here, but that’s not to say we couldn’t give some more attention to recruiting on our end and play our hand as best we can.

The skill players in our offense aren’t the problem, nor is the scheme they run. We need better people on both lines, maybe better coaching on those lines, and we need more playmakers on D. Scoring 30+ points—like in the georgie game last year—ought to win a ballgame, but if you don’t have the D you can lose it even with good offensive output.

I’d rather invest money in another Giff Smith who can recruit rather than chase down an all-purpose special teams coach (which most teams DON’T have). Maybe we can pull an LSU and find some international soccer or Aussie Rules star, and bring that guy over to kick.

by jabbajacket on Nov 29, 2011 11:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Yep.

Still sucks that B Wing didn’t get nominated for the best punter award. Average return for opposing return teams when he punts? 21 INCHES. He didn’t hit the minimum number of punts to qualify.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 11:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Do you want a kicking coach or a return coverage coach?

Those are different responsibilities which is why there hasn’t been a 100% special teams coach

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

Twitter, twitter, twitter

by Winfield Featherston on Nov 29, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions  

I understand...

and for the most part our ST play doesn’t look like a hot mess. However, I don’t perceive that we win any field position battles because we can’t seem to get a kick return past the 30, and our punter sucks at maximizing the net punt yardage. As a point of comparison…Jawjah looked incredibly more prepared and organized than we did.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 10:11 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

we need a juco transfer punter

remember Ben Arndt and Durrant Brooks??? Those were the days.

I write stuff From the Rumble Seat.

by BirdGT on Nov 29, 2011 10:13 AM EST up reply actions  

for nostalgia's sake

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

Twitter, twitter, twitter

by Winfield Featherston on Nov 29, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions  

Hopefully DB’s kin will have strong legs…

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 29, 2011 10:39 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

The kicking and punting seemed much improved over the last few games. Scully has been getting the KO inside the 10 consistently, and has an number of kicks inside the 5 as well as kicking a couple of touchbacks. On the punts, I think the consistency has increased. It would be nice to see some booming 70 yard punts, but I think the distance has adequate of late. Punt coverage seems to be OK. KO coverage continues to be a problem.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 29, 2011 10:47 AM EST up reply actions  

out of 11 current commits

6 of them are from the state of GA
3 of them are from FL
1 is from AL
1 is from Md

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

Twitter, twitter, twitter

by Winfield Featherston on Nov 30, 2011 10:24 AM EST up reply actions  

Yes…but they are nowhere near the cream of the crop in terms of talent in the state of Georgia. As I mentioned before, what if Francis Kallon didn’t commit before his star exploded? Do you think his odds of going to GT increase or decrease if other schools are able to recruit and contact him for more than a year?

Chase Roberts and Will Adams are pretty much Tech legacies. Which means the other 4 from Georgia…Kallon, Gamble, Summers, and Gnonkonde are the best we can persuade to come to Tech. That’s one 4-star…and three 3-star student athletes.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 10:31 AM EST up reply actions  

About Kallon

I kind of thought that Kallon demonstrated that CPJ and company have an idea about what they are doing with recruiting because they took him when everyone else was shying away. Perhaps it was a risky offer since he had never played, but nevertheless they were able to look past that and see the potential.

Had Kallon not committed before his star status increased, would he have still committed to GT? I don’t know. He was recruited for defense not offense, so he was being recruited on a more level playing field (i.e. shielded from ‘you can’t go to the NFL in that offense’). On the flip side, it’s not clear what Kallon wants to do after college. If he’s not interested in the NFL, then the ability to prepare him for the NFL would not be a selling point for teams that use that as a big selling point. He’s not a traditional recruit so it’s hard to say what would have happened.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 30, 2011 10:43 AM EST up reply actions  

True...Kallon isn't the typical recruit.

Which is sad in a way. Anyway…my opinion was based on where the remaining high-profile players currently being recruited from…outside the state of Georgia. Guys like Devin Fuller, Ryan Watson, Elijah Shumate, and Yuri Wright (all 4-star guys) are being recruited from CAG’s old mid-Atlantic area (MD, NJ). Keith Marshall (not that we have a chance at him), Todd Gurley, Alex McAllister, Jamal Marcus, and Tysean Holloway are being recruited from McCollum’s NC network.

My concern is that we are going after no 4-star or better GA kids…

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 10:53 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Here is where I get real close to saying something that gets me in trouble with uga fans . . .

In my opinion Georgia rarely goes after the same kinds of players that Tech is interested in. I have said this before and I will say it again. When I was at a small school that looked at potential student athletes we never simply considered whether they were good athletes. We always asked 3 questions that were far more important than their relative athletic ability. We asked: Are they a good fit for our community? Will they stick around? Do we have something to teach them?

The athletes that could most likely fit at both Tech and Georgia are just as likely to go out of state as they are to choose in state.

by Atlanta's original team on Nov 30, 2011 2:13 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Are they a good fit for our community? Will they stick around? Do we have something to teach them?

This seems to reduce your overall sample size by quite a bit doesn’t it?

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Not trying to be a smart aleck

We just knew that not every student (athlete or otherwise) was a good fit for what we were trying to do. We passed out athletic scholarships with the same philosophy as we sent acceptance letters to those who applied for admission. We had a special and unique mission, as I assume Tech does. That means that you are not going to offer to the same type of student that other institutions offer to.

Before some one jumps my case (because they almost always do) let me say this is not a snob thing, though there may be some of that. It is mainly a matter of asking an honest question like, “How many of UGA’s current football players would be happy with or fit in with the Tech community?”

Here is a different illustration that demonstrates that this is not about snobbery or class consciousness. Two years ago In Harvard’s entering Freshman class there was a young woman who was given a substantial scholarship. She did not even go to high school. She was home schooled in the cab of an 18 wheeler. Her parents were truck drivers. She was admitted because she had the kind of intellectual curiosity, engaging personality and adventurous spirit that Harvard was looking for.

Reminds me a little bit of Kallon.

by Atlanta's original team on Nov 30, 2011 3:02 PM EST up reply actions  

An economist would argue...

that in terms of football, the academic rigor carries significant opportunity costs in terms of limiting your ability to market and build your program.

I get it though…if you bend your standards to accommodate football players, you eventually bend your standards to everyone…and GT doesn’t remain the academic leader it strives to be.

We just have to learn…in this currently blurred line of academics, amateur athletics, and multimillion dollar business…that GT is a model that doesn’t lend itself to perennial 10+ win seasons.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 3:46 PM EST up reply actions  

I am making a more subtle distinction here

Maybe the best way to illustrate this would be to point to the current disarray with Tech’s basketball program. It did not get that way overnight. It got that way because over time students were recruited who were perhaps not that interested in Tech. I would argue that if you recruit the right kid then over time you build the brand and in turn the brand sells to more and more kids. Tech will do fine if it keeps its focus.

Now let me illustrate this with Georgia in a different way. I would argue that even though Georgia has lots of advantages in recruiting due to a “less narrow” recruiting profile they too will do better, not worse, if they stick to their principles over time rather than chasing after studs. Kids need to find the right college fit or they end up in situations where they don’t perform well and the institution loses its investment.

by Atlanta's original team on Nov 30, 2011 6:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Duke basketball is probably the best example...

of a program recruiting the best talent and having them stay almost all 4 years of eligibility.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Nov 30, 2011 6:35 PM EST up reply actions  

As I mentioned before, what if Francis Kallon didn’t commit before his star exploded? Do you think his odds of going to GT increase or decrease if other schools are able to recruit and contact him for more than a year?

I still maintain that star rating would not have affected Kallon’s school choice much. One thing to keep in mind — Kallon is from England. Or, in other words, he’s from somewhere that isn’t America, meaning he’s from somewhere where the family of an athlete is more likely to be appreciative of all of the factors that come into play when choosing where to play college football. I’m sure his parents didn’t see him get an offer from Alabama and immediately think, “Holy shit! They just won a national title a couple years ago and now they want OUR BOY to come play ball for them!”

No, they saw a scholarship offer from Tech and said, “Our boy has a chance to go play football for a quality program while studying at a top-rated institution that will set him up for success in the future, NFL or otherwise.” That’s why I think he’s a great choice for Tech (on both sides), and I also think that’s why you never saw him sway towards georgie or Auburn or anyone else.

The Church of Paul Johnson - There's not much to it outside of whooping ass and giving haters the finger. To HELL With georgie!

by LilBroey700 on Nov 30, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions  

I think most of England

doesn’t care about academics at all

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

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by Winfield Featherston on Dec 1, 2011 11:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Is this serious?

Because English citizenship allows for you to attend whichever college (in England) you qualify for at no cost…

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2011 12:47 PM EST up reply actions  

Maybe people I talk to just like to make up BS

(wouldn’t be the first time) but all I hear is how kids are pulled out of school to go to the soccer academies and hope to get rich

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

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by Winfield Featherston on Dec 1, 2011 1:05 PM EST up reply actions  

My sister's first teaching job was at Middle School in a pretty poor area in FL...

And during a parent-teacher conference she was actually told that the amount of HW that she assigned interfered with their child’s football practice time. I think it’s more reflective of a downward spiraling socio-economic cycle in each area rather than a reflection of the culture as a whole.

That being said…in England there are several hundreds of football teams in a country of roughly 50MM-60MM people. Odds are better there of playing pro sports for a living (albeit meager)…but I believe those academies have been federally regulated to maintain equitable academic progress and traditional schools.

"Reach down in there...TURN THAT DAMN THING UP!" - Coach Paul Johnson

by TBuzz on Dec 1, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions  

A la Idiocracy style

“WHHHHEEEEWWWW! IMA ^&* ALL YOU $^&*(# !!!!!! WHHHHEEEEEEWWWWW!!!!!”

Followed by:

“DATS MA BOY!!!!”

From The Rumble Seat -Drinkin' whiskey clear since 2008.

"You could spend the next fifteen seconds of your life watching a man and a tiger scream together, or you could be an idiot."
Fact.

by Jesse28 on Dec 1, 2011 1:55 PM EST up reply actions  

That hasn't been true for a decade

Tuition fees were introduced in England by Labour in 1998. They started off modest (~£1000/year, and an English degree is three years), then rose to ~£3,000/year. However, from next autumn, any EU student studying in England will be charged £9,000/year in tuition fees, which is on par with only the most expensive of public universities in the United States. Students from Scotland will have their fees paid by the Scottish government, regardless of which home nation they study in, and there are no tuition fees for Scottish or non-UK EU students at Scottish universities. Students from the rest of the UK will pay fees comparable to the new English rates.

by NoDak_jacket on Dec 2, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions  

This is crazy talk

The country that brought us Oxford and Cambridge doesn’t care about academics? Surely you jest. Because, until recently (see reply to TBuzz), it was very inexpensive for British students to attend British universities. Families didn’t bother saving up to send their children to university, because they didn’t need to; the costs were so small they knew that their children would easily be able to pay for them once they graduated. The British are every bit obsessed with rankings (they call them league tables, to match up with the soccer/football terminology) of universities as the Americans are. However, now with astronomical tuition fees coming in, many students will have to make choices that only existed in the US before. For instance, is a degree from University X, a couple hundred miles from home, really worth a couple thousand pounds per year more in tuition fees and then much more in living expenses than the local university that’s reasonably well-respected? Oxbridge’s application numbers from students attending state schools (what would be public schools in the US, but in the UK “public school” means “elite private school”) are way down this year because of the tuition fee hikes.

I think where the big difference comes in is that you don’t get a scholarship to play sports at uni in the UK. Sport is something people do for fun (even this unathletic American has taken up tag rugby…think flag football, only rugby) and the best get to play semi-pro and then pro, but they don’t play for a team at Oxford or Southampton or East Anglia and then go play in the EPL.

by NoDak_jacket on Dec 2, 2011 12:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I knew you'd be the one to clear this up

Thank you sir!

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

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by Winfield Featherston on Dec 2, 2011 8:26 AM EST up reply actions  

2 OL coaches

This would be a great question for CPJ. “Why do you have two OL coaches? What are the responsibilities of each OL coach? Have you considered having just one OL coach?”

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 29, 2011 9:46 AM EST reply actions  

You got a question for me, son?

Huh? Was that a question I heard ya ask with that soud-hole of yours?? I’ll tell ya why: one coach to stand ‘em still while I bite their heads off for missin’ a blocking assignment, and another to comfort them as they try to salvage what’s left of their dignity.

No hostility intended- that picture was too priceless to pass up.

THWG!

by gtg991z on Nov 29, 2011 9:56 AM EST up reply actions  

Somehow, your answer seems like it isn’t too far from the truth. Must be the picture.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 29, 2011 10:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

Twitter, twitter, twitter

by Winfield Featherston on Nov 29, 2011 10:57 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I agree. Excellent question.

To me it smacks of “good old boyism”, esp as poorly as the OL has played overall.

by The Bamboo Shaft on Nov 29, 2011 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Different blocking techniques

Pretty sure he’s been asked this on the radio show at some point and said that it was because of how many blocking techniques the OL needed to know. I’m not sure if one coach works with some OL positions and the other with the remainder or if they break it up by skills, but it seems the point is that our OL is asked to do more/different things than other OL, so he wants two coaches on them.

by NoDak_jacket on Dec 2, 2011 1:24 AM EST up reply actions  

How could you forget Slick Rick?

who was just canned from his alma mater UCLA.

by The Bamboo Shaft on Nov 29, 2011 10:40 AM EST reply actions  

good catch

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

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by Winfield Featherston on Nov 29, 2011 10:47 AM EST up reply actions  

Thanks.

I remember he was a leading candidate and I was SOOO relieved when we hired PJ as I never liked him. I never thought he would do THAT poorly at UCLA though. We dodged a bullet there.

by The Bamboo Shaft on Nov 29, 2011 11:10 AM EST up reply actions  

To his credit

he IS taking them to the inaugural Pac-12 championship game though. ;)

by The Bamboo Shaft on Nov 29, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Via the backdoor.

Similar to the way my fluid mechanics would poke me no matter how hard I studied.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

This is the saddest post ever about that game

Better to have died a small boy than to drop this football - John Heisman FromTheRumbleSeat

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by Winfield Featherston on Nov 29, 2011 11:43 AM EST up reply actions  

some stats to chew on:

Bobby Dodd was 1-3 against georgie in his first four years.

Now I’m not saying CPJ is the next Dodd, but we can’t let our early unexpected success allow us to become impatient. Be patient. It takes time to fully implement a system.

Patience.

This is my Family Tradition

by The_GT_LineageX11 on Nov 29, 2011 11:43 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

And O'Leary dropped his first 4 against georgie...

…before peeling off 3 in a row. Probably would have won in ’01 too if his head had been on the Flats instead of on Touchdown Jesus.

by jabbajacket on Nov 29, 2011 11:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Interesting chart and data.

CPJ ranks at the top of the 2008 coaching hires. Bo Pelini (who ranks at the top of that list) has done well at Nebraska, although probably not as well as they hoped. But he definitely turned that disastrous defense around 180 degrees, showing that good coaching makes a huge difference. And it’s hard to believe that Whittlin’ Bill Stewart won 70% of his games at WVU… not good enough though, obviously. :)

by The Bamboo Shaft on Nov 29, 2011 11:43 AM EST reply actions  

I think the 1st year head coaches should be excluded or include the coaches who left to make

room for them. I wonder how long Stanford will continue this trend. Harbaugh’s gone. Luck will probably leave after this year. BC went downhill after the departure of Matt Ryan.

by 071u on Nov 29, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Johnson is the right man for the job

Certainly, there have been times where I wanted to throw my beer at the television because of a decision Paul Johnson made during a game. Like against VT, going for it on 4th-and-1 early in the 4th quarter from their own 31……but I digress.

I think CPJ is the right man for the job. He prepares his teams well, has a great offensive mind, and if he ever figures out the defensive problems, we’re talking ACC Championships. If we win our bowl game this year, that’s at least 9 wins in 3 of his 4 seasons.

My Yahoo Article On Game Against Georgia

by Joe Roberts on Nov 30, 2011 1:00 AM EST reply actions  

December 2013

I think December 2013 will be the opportunity to completely evaluate CPJ as a head coach for GT. At that point, the team should have played a season with a full complement of upperclassmen (not the handful there is today) who have been practicing and playing in CPJ’s offense since Day 1. I think the question of whether or not the offense ‘works’ has been more than adequately answered already, but we should know for sure by then. On the recruting side, enough time will have passed to properly evaluate recruiting under CPJ. Right now the team is so young that while we have ideas about the state of recruiting, we don’t know for sure. Actually, for the must-have-NFL-talent crowd, April 2014 will the month because we’ll find out then just how many of CPJ’s recruits go to the NFL.

by Dive Keep and Pitch on Nov 30, 2011 10:12 AM EST reply actions  

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